Do you use elemental directions in your practice? Does it matter? Is it all subjective and relative? Is it tradition for the sake of tradition?

I have recently been enjoying the "Temple of Witchcraft" series by Christopher Penczak. I have truly liked alot of his work but there is an annoying thing that is bugging me... his directions for the Elements or Quarters is different from what I'm used to. I've been just overlooking it... but I also got the CD companions for the books (which contain meditations), and it is a bit of a pet peeve when I'm meditating and he announces a quadrant and gets it *ahem*.... "wrong"...according to me

So I guess the question is... does it even matter to most people? I'm thinking that in the end it is mainly for ritual purposes, maybe respectful purposes if we're calling quadrant elementals or spirits.... and that it probably doesn't really matter in the slightest. I'm also thinking that its only a "pet peeve" of mine because it happens to be different from the way I learned it and have practiced it for so long.

So the discussion question is this: "Does the specific directions of the elements matter at all?" and a follow-up question could be "Do you use specific directions for the elements, and what are they?"

For me, I always use:

North -- Earth
East -- Air
South -- Fire
West -- Water

I use elemental directions because they make sense to me. Some of it also i think is tradition, (why fix or change something that isn't broken?)

It is a bit frustrating to read a Penczak book though and feel like going "that's not right!"

I learned and used the same ....

In a matter of perspective....

You and I are both pagans... yet you are a witch and I am still not sure where I fit somewhere between witch and druid... if there is such a place..

no matter what I call you or you call me.. the meaning is the same. I think perhaps... (and keep in mind I haven't read that series... its on my wish list..lol) but perhaps the author was trying a new twist to an ancient idea purely for the "twists" sake? Just a thought.

To me it matters not whether the elements or quadrants are called by different names... they are still the elements, and I call upon them for several things: rituals, daily devotionals and when I'm learning studying to help me understand that which I can not by myself.

It matters not what name we give the God and the Goddess they are still that which moves us, and provide us with life..

This may not be the most educational answer... but I hope it helps.

Blessed Be
Touching Earth

My ritual use of the elements has taken on a big change as I cross from the Wiccan elements (no pun intended) I've learned earlier on and into Hellenismos. I do call upon the spirits of the directional winds and honor them as the servants of Hera, the Queen of the Air; and Zeus, the King of the Sky.

My reverence for fire has increased, but changed. Fire is no longer a transcendant idea from the southern quarter for me as it had been in the past, but a representation of the sacred hearth. It's the warmth of family, community, and the presence of Hestia in the mortal world. It also serves as a reminder to me of the creator, Prometheus, and the divine gift he bestowed upon us. The spark of fire he gave mortals could easily be seen as the concept of the soul.

In my current practice, water becomes very important. Each ritual begins with katharsis, and I wash my hands and anoint myself with lustral water. This cleanses me of miasma and brings me into a state of purity before I approach the Gods in ritual.

Earth has also changed for me. I once respresented it with stone, but now it takes on the form of grain. I make offerings of barley to the Gods in my rituals, and I take bread in communion with Demeter. The sacrificial feast is a major part of Greek ritual, and serves not only as a meal shared with the Gods, but also as a reminder that for our lives to flourish, life of some kind must be taken. We aren't above the cycle, even if we may have a more detached awareness of it than our ancestors did.

I don't think it's the directions or representations that matter, but the ideas behind the elements themselves. The elements can be seen in just about every ceremonial path, even if those practicing aren't aware of them.

That's the same as me... and from what I can tell, that's how its listed in most Wiccan books, including old ceremonial magic systems like the Golden Dawn. However Penczak's system mixes the fire and air... he has Fire in the East and Air in the South. He is a popular author with a great many books that sell alot of copies... overall I like his writings... and I also like his meditation cd's but I get distracted when he wants me to focus on the East and call to Fire. I'm probably just really stuck in my ways LOL.

That's partly why I was wondering if anyone here has them in different positions like that or not.

I don't think it honestly matters. I had a couple friends over for Samhain and we did a ritual togeather, and Angel anounced that I had two of my elements "mixed up," meaning that she had water in the east, and air in the west. This confused me a little; I just can't see them being that way, but that's how she does it so it's okay. I think that people associate the elements to directions in ways that make sense to them. I actually have thought about why I associate earth with the north, etc, and have come up with my logic quite easily.

North: Earth. I used to live up north, and that's where things are green (or so I have observed)
East: Air. To the east of me most of the land is planes where there's a lot of wind. It just seems like a "windy" direction to me.
South: Fire. I live in the northern hemisphere, so down south things get hotter.
West: Water. I live more toward the west, and so the water is *ahem* to the west of me.

And these corrospondences probably won't change for me when I move, because my logic works there, too. And it's just the way I've done it for the past... three an 1/4 years.

I once heard the following explanation for the traditional directions of the elements.... not sure if this is historically accurate but it stuck with me...

I was told that the particular directions of the elements were originally created by the peoples of the eastern mediteranean sea, and for them:

North -- had mountains and forests for many miles, so they associated it with "Earth"
East -- had vast plains where it looked like "big sky" and had lots of wind so they went with "Air"
South -- had vast deserts so they associated it with "Fire"
West --- had the atlantic ocean so they associated it with "Water"

So when I was originally taught I was told to imagine a map of Europe, with the ocean to the west, the Sahara Desert to the south and so on in order to remember which direction went with what.

I guess it depends what way your facing at the time

I remember them by sorting each group using the alphabet

Air
Earth
Fire
Water

-
East
North
South
West

I too follow North/Earth, East/Air, South/Fire, West/Water. However, as a Tarot reader I understand that sometimes the quality of elements can change.

This is what made me think of that. I haven't read any of his books, but perhaps he makes the switch in the same way traditional Tarot makes the switch?
Just my initial reaction.

Back to the question: I don't know if it matters. I have built deep connections with the direction/element correspondence as I learned them, but that doesn't mean other people should be bound to my ideas.